ow long was your DM, DIVECON,AI course?

[Waynne Fowler]

I'm just wondering how long it took you to complete your Dive Master, Dive Control Specialist, or you Assistant Instructor training
was it too long, too short?
worth the cost/trouble
Are you still active?
How long have you/were you active.
why are you no loner active?
How long have you been inactive?
could you be persuaded to get active once again.

[enchantmentdivi]

My Dive Con course lasted approximately 6 months but it was pretty intensive. Each week had a class sessions, pool sessions, OW dives, helping with OW classes, etc, etc, etc. Busy time for sure, but I felt like I got a very good, thorough class with a ton of practical, hands on experience.

I think it was totally worth the cost/time. I learned a lot, and I learned how to change my way of thinking when it comes to diving. I'm sure that class has saved my butt or somebody else's butt more than I'll ever know.

I was very active for 5-6 years helping with OW classes, doing guided dives, leading tons of club dives, and running a dive club. I was somewhat active for another 2-3 years after that.

I am no longer active because it's time for me to just be a diver again. I got into diving to see the pretty fishies. I did not get into diving to teach (NEVER wantd to be an instructor) or to deal with the politics. It's time to see the pretty fishies again--time to come full circle. I also "retired" due to liability. I was tired of worrying whether someone would do something stupid on my watch that would then impact my entire life.

I have been inactive since January of this year. LOVING IT.

NO, I will never be active again.

[kagey747]

It took me the better part of a year to complete DiveCon, mostly due to the fact that I'm out of the country 2/3rds of the time. The training and experience were great, I'm a much more aware, informed and competent diver now than I was before. Worth the money? Depends... I have more than made up my course costs through free airfills and "dive professional" discounts on equipment, but have spent a great deal of unreimbursed time assisting at the shop, pool, and during course dives as an instructor's assistant. It has been absolutely worth it for me, and I would do it again. Although I have no desire to become a full-blown instructor, I do enjoy passing on my experience to new divers and sharing in their enjoyment and sense of accomplishment. The shop I work with is run by a truely fantastic individual, the instructors are experienced and professional, and those facts directly affect whether or not you will have a equally favorable and fulfilling experience. I suggest you talk with the other DiveCons and instructors at the shop you intend to be associated with.

[CaptnJack]

For DM
was it too long, too short? neither really, just lots of loose ends took months to wrap up (O2 provider etc)

worth the cost/trouble eh I guess so, its fun in small doses

Are you still active? no

How long have you/were you active. never, not worth the insurance

why are you no loner active? seriously paying ~$350 a year out of my pocket for insurance so I can officially volunteer my time, fuel and breathing gas to help classes? I don't think so.

How long have you been inactive? since I got the card

could you be persuaded to get active once again vastly reduced insurance costs and/or per class insurance subsidy, eg I am only insured for the duration of a class and students pay $25 extra to cover my insurance.

[kagey747]

Captn Jack reinforces my suggestion to talk with the DiveCons who are working with the outfit you intend to be associated with, as well as the shop owner. My shop covers the insurance for all DiveCon related activities run through the shop as well as free airfills. I wasn't aware that other shops didn't. It is a definite consideration.

[CaptnJack]

Captn Jack reinforces my suggestion to talk with the DiveCons who are working with the outfit you intend to be associated with, as well as the shop owner. My shop covers the insurance for all DiveCon related activities run through the shop as well as free airfills. I wasn't aware that other shops didn't. It is a definite consideration.

Good point.
My instructor friends/buddies are not affiliated with a shop and I really wouldn't DM for anyone else, so my circumstances are a bit unusual. I still "volunteer" with them occasionally since I am not acting for hire anyway.

[coulterboy]

I suggest you talk with the other DiveCons and instructors at the shop you intend to be associated with.

Wayne is an instructor and is affiliated with a shop.

[Waynne Fowler]

Wayne is an instructor and is affiliated with a shop.

we GOTTA get out again T.... I had such a nice time at alki.... WInter's been ticked at me since we were up there.... it may have something to do with the fact that I told her viz was like 200' and 77 degrees at 55'????????????

That was such a nice dive.... M's gonna be a great buddy for ya!

[kagey747]

My bad, Waynne; I thought you were someone thinking about becoming a DM,etc, not an instructor surveying why there weren't more DM, DiveCon, AI people active or in training. I can tell you that I will stay active as long as I feel useful, not used, and am still enjoying the interaction with new divers and professional instructors.

[coulterboy]

we GOTTA get out again T.... I had such a nice time at alki.... WInter's been ticked at me since we were up there.... it may have something to do with the fact that I told her viz was like 200' and 7

Yeah, not to mention, we made it in the paper.

[Waynne Fowler]

My bad, Waynne; I thought you were someone thinking about becoming a DM,etc, not an instructor surveying why there weren't more DM, DiveCon, AI people active or in training. I can tell you that I will stay active as long as I feel useful, not used, and am still enjoying the interaction with new divers and professional instructors.

LOL no worries at all... how could you have known. Really why I wonder is that though I've never had the desire to train DM's... it's a HUGE commitment on everyones part.... it seems that sooner rather than later I will be doing just that, while it's exciting it's also a bit nerve wracking... The biggest complaint I've heard from folks is about the length of the course. While I firmly believe that a 5-6 week DM course is a joke I find it hard to imagine also that it needs to take a year to get through.
Further there needs to be (IMHO) a compensation program for them... most of the folks that I know had most of their equipment prior to becoming a DM so the equipment discount only works so well for so long then it becomes rather useless. I know for me, such was the case. That's a rather hard nut to crack trying to figure out compensation.

I've never heard of a DM who paid their own insurance so that someone else could have an easier time making a living... yeah... I live a sheltered life.... Interesting.... amazing is a better term maybe. I can't even abide by letting the DM's pay their yearly cert fee's and then ask them to go out with me on their days/time off, using their gas and free time to make mine and my students life easier.

we GOTTA get out again T.... I had such a nice time at alki.... WInter's been ticked at me since we were up there.... it may have something to do with the fact that I told her viz was like 200' and 7

Yeah, not to mention, we made it in the paper.

I know huh.... though he coulda chose a better pic.

[CaptnJack]

I've never heard of a DM who paid their own insurance so that someone else could have an easier time making a living... yeah... I live a sheltered life.... Interesting.... amazing is a better term maybe. I can't even abide by letting the DM's pay their yearly cert fee's and then ask them to go out with me on their days/time off, using their gas and free time to make mine and my students life easier.

Even if my annual fees (insurance etc) were offered to be paid (by independent instructors not affilated with a shop which is a bit a stretch IMHO), I wouldn't commit to doing X classes in exchange. No thanks.

[Tom Nic]

I am no longer active because it's time for me to just be a diver again. I got into diving to see the pretty fishies. I did not get into diving to teach (NEVER wantd to be an instructor) or to deal with the politics. It's time to see the pretty fishies again--time to come full circle. I also "retired" due to liability. I was tired of worrying whether someone would do something stupid on my watch that would then impact my entire life.

I have been inactive since January of this year. LOVING IT.

NO, I will never be active again.

I was half-way through my DM, including having paid half of it, when I realized what Jenn wrote above. It says something about the marketing and pressure that she went as far as she did as long as she did before realizing it. (I know NOTHING of Jenn's personal experience and if you put a gun to my head I couldn't tell you what shop she was primarily with, so this is a general observation, not a swipe at any person / shop / organization.)

Half way through my DM (I know, I know, I'm slow) I started asking myself: Why am I doing this? What will I gain as far as my long term diving goals that I could not do without my DM cert? How will what I've learned and what I will learn make me a better diver? The answer for the last two questions was "not much", which kind of answered my first question for me.

I realized that since I did not plan to teach in the future that the main thing I got out of a completed DM cert was hassle and potential liability. The gear discounts were tempting, but not tempting enough. You have to LOVE hanging out with new students in a classroom atmosphere and really want to hang out with the instructors in your shop on a personal level and give of your time and effort for the sheer joy of it. But I can do that informally as many others do on this board, and not muck with the liability cost or other issues.

In short, unless one really has a desire to teach, in my opinion there isn't much of a reason to collect cards once you're at DM or above. To a new (ignorant) diver DiveMASTER sounds impressive, but six years and 600+ dives after my initial certification it really isn't. So I collected cards for the first 18 months or so up to Master Scuba Diver, then stopped and got about the business of becoming a better diver. (My Rescue Diver course was BY FAR the most beneficial course I ever took.)

I actually think a diver who doesn't plan to teach that wants to improve their skills as a diver would benefit more from diving and diving and diving, and then at some point spend the $$ you would have spent on the DM course for some one on one instruction with a really together, excellent instructor of good reputation (there are several on this board) that would take you through your paces, evaluate your skills, and help you improve on what you need to do better that you will really use in the real world of PNW wonderful cold water diving.

Card collecting was fun, but I can have a fistful and not be that great of a diver. Apologies in advance... too old and tired to be taking shots at anyone, just an old guy (who has been diving FAR too little the last few months) giving my .02 psi worth. YMMCV (Your Mileage May Certainly Vary!)

[Geek]

I've been asked to DM but my answer has always been "I enjoy my diving, I don't want to make it WORK" of course now I have some other long term goals I'm looking at so I might have too...

[BASSMAN]

For me, no interest in becoming an instructor so no interest becoming a DM.
Let's go diving!

Keith.

[Waynne Fowler]

Sounds like it'll be even harder than I imagined to make a DM class valuable in the long term..... FWIW.. me... DM'ing was one of the funnest most gratifying things I've ever done. Going from a non dive thru the S&R course was sure a huge leap but going from Rescue to DM was 10x's the step IMHO... I learned far more about myself, my abilities, weaknesses and strengths than in all my other course's combined. I think that is because I was learning to deal with others 'rather' than myself.
Thanks everyone for you responses.

See you in the water!

[Blaiz]

being affiliated with the same shop as kagey747, and in the same dm course (or at least on the same meandering course to becoming a DM) I do it because it's fun to work with new students. not that long ago, I had no idea what the gear was, what it was called, how to set it up, and i can still remember the enchantment of my first dives. I enjoy being there to answer questions, and help make new divers. if it becomes work, i probably would be less interested, since i have a full time job, but as it stands, i would be sitting on the couch those six nights per month (as proof, i submit the other 24 nights per month i sit on the couch anyway) as far as liability, yeah my shop covers the insurance, i would be less impressed to cover it myself

[enchantmentdivi]

I've never heard of a DM who paid their own insurance so that someone else could have an easier time making a living...

I paid for my own insurance through the shop's group policy. That averaged around $150/year. One more reason to go inactive for me. Lots of money going out (also paid my yearly SSI dues to be active) and no money coming in for "volunteering".

[Waynne Fowler]

I've never heard of a DM who paid their own insurance so that someone else could have an easier time making a living...

I paid for my own insurance through the shop's group policy. That averaged around $150/year. One more reason to go inactive for me. Lots of money going out (also paid my yearly SSI dues to be active) and no money coming in for "volunteering".

ouch... i'da quit too.

[LCF]

It took me about six months to get through my DM, and most of the time was due to logistics. I had a lot of advanced training and experience before I started it, so I didn't learn much of anything from the academics. Most of the active learning was emulating an excellent DM role model on how to do presentation-quality skills, and working with students.

I like to teach things, but I'm quite ambivalent about DMing open water classes. I love the pool work, but the OW dives frankly scare me silly half the time. Having brand new divers in the water, heavily stressed by unfamiliar equipment and exposure protection and weight, in what rapidly becomes zero viz, is a very stressful situation for me. I'm always worried that someone is going to do something really stupid and I'm not going to see it coming, possibly because I can't see much at all!

I think I would really enjoy working with more advanced classes, as I enormously enjoy the mentoring activities I've been involved in, but my instructor-husband hasn't taught many of those yet.

I think that, if you are not interested in teaching or leading dives, a DM class is not a particularly good investment of time and money. If you are interested in better diving skills, there are other classes that are more suited to that.