Outfitting a boat for diving

[scottsax]

My brother has a 26 ft Bayliner that he uses for fishing and crabbing. I'd like to have him take me and buddies out for diving. Clearly he needs an alpha and a diver-down flag, but besides first aid supplies, what else should somebody have on a private boat to support divers? Anyone here ever outfitted their own boat for diving?

Thanks,

Scott

[Dmitchell]

Assuming the Bayliner has a Swim step and no real ladder of course a ladder is nice to have. The Garelick models are good ladders at a reasonable price.

If you don't have a ladder or even with a ladder you don't want to climb out with gear on then some lines with bolt snaps or clips that you can hang over the side of the boat while you are diving so that when you come up you can clip your gear off and get out of it.

A line rigged from the anchor line to the stern is nice for helping get up to the downline in a current. Also a tag line of say 50' tied off from the stern so that if you miss the boat in the current, you have something to grab is nice. I took about 50' of line put a crab float on the far end and a little cork about every 10'.

Obvious safety gear, First Aid Kit, Oxygen, Cell Phone , Vhf Radio.

Tank racks are nice but on a 26' Bayliner may or may not be necessary. My brother's 28' Bayliner has very low sides on the stern so I would imagine not on his boat. You have enough cabin space that you can tuck spare tanks away without clogging up the back deck.

If it's a nice boat then I would look into some matting to help protect his deck and other area's from tanks and weights. Whatever Costco has for floor mats will usually work fine for this.

So all in all a not alot is necessary just a few convienence items and you are on the water!

Dave

[scottsax]

Obvious safety gear, First Aid Kit, Oxygen, Cell Phone , Vhf Radio.

Tank racks are nice but on a 26' Bayliner may or may not be necessary. My brother's 28' Bayliner has very low sides on the stern so I would imagine not on his boat.

Not having taken Rescue Diver yet, any special items needed for the First Aid kit? Where does one buy an emergency oxygen supply-my LDS? Do you think pelican racks, or just lay down some of the cheap foam guys?

Thanks for the info!

[Dmitchell]

O2 Kit probably comes from DAN. You can get them elsewhere but in the end the price comes out close and throwing a little money at DAN is never a bad thing.

Talk to Valerie "Zen Diver 2" about being trained to use it and other diving medical classes, she's your local expert.

I wouldn't use pelican racks they take up way too much space. Just lay them under the dinette with a weight belt on either side.

Dave

[CaptnJack]

Not having taken Rescue Diver yet, any special items needed for the First Aid kit? Where does one buy an emergency oxygen supply-my LDS?

DAN sells nice O2 kits or you can build your own.

Fire King sells med O2 cylinders you want at least an "E" size (~20cf)
Med O2 reg with minimum 15L/min of flow from Ebay
Non-rebreather mask(s) online from any number of dealers
Keep the whole deal in a dry locker or a dry bag from REI

Randy Williams / Starfish Diving will fill DAN/med O2 cylinders for free.

2 items not normally found in stock 1st aid kits:
Vinegar is helpful for jellyfish stings
Good tweezers to remove foreign objects (like splinters from a dock!)

[Zen Diver]

DAN sells nice O2 kits or you can build your own.

2 items not normally found in stock 1st aid kits:
Vinegar is helpful for jellyfish stings
Good tweezers to remove foreign objects (like splinters from a dock!)

You can build your own, but I"ve found that the price usually breaks down the same, and you've had to go all over to piece it together. Much more convenient to just buy one outright that has everything you need.

And, vinegar is actually no longer recommended for jellyfish stings. The current treatment is hot water/heat.

-Valerie

[CaptnJack]

Med O2 reg on ebay = $20 + $5 shipping
Refurbished Med O2 tank from Fire King = $60
Nonrebreather mask online = $10 + $8 shipping
Free O2 fill from Starfish
Total Cost = $103 A far cry from the $450-500 DAN wants for an O2 kit. Granted it won't have a demand regulator, but you could get 2 O2 tanks and still save a ton of cash. Knowing how thrifty most of the board members here are, its an option.

It may be less effective, but I prefer vinegar since I don't have to remember to fill a thermos.

[scottsax]

You can build your own, but I"ve found that the price usually breaks down the same, and you've had to go all over to piece it together. Much more convenient to just buy one outright that has everything you need.

And, vinegar is actually no longer recommended for jellyfish stings. The current treatment is hot water/heat.

-Valerie

Valerie-
How do I go about taking the DAN first aid/CPR classes? The word on the street, well, the word on this board, is that you are the DAN goddess... You can PM me or post here for the edification of other newbs, if you want.

I love this board! Everybody here is so helpful!

thanks,

Scott

[Dmitchell]

I prefer to have the demand mask available and that's the expensive part of the DAN kit.

A Jumbo D flowing 15LPM will last about 40-42 minutes. With the demand mask you can stretch that tank to almost an hour maybe a bit more.

Given that we are talking about being on a boat here, and not the beach at ALKI, that 20 minutes could be really important. You could buy more bottles but then you have to store them on the boat and deal with the cost of maintenance on them.

I'm not into throwing money away, but IMO the quality of your O2 kit should be no less than the quality of your primary regulator. If and when you need it you won't care what it cost.

DM

[Zen Diver]

Med O2 reg on ebay = $20 + $5 shipping
Refurbished Med O2 tank from Fire King = $60
Nonrebreather mask online = $10 + $8 shipping
Free O2 fill from Starfish
Total Cost = $103 A far cry from the $450-500 DAN wants for an O2 kit. Granted it won't have a demand regulator, but you could get 2 O2 tanks and still save a ton of cash. Knowing how thrifty most of the board members here are, its an option.

It may be less effective, but I prefer vinegar since I don't have to remember to fill a thermos.

Many Medical Regs only go to 8 l/m, and for scuba purposes you need to be able to start at 15 l/m and go to 20-25 if needed. If you run a non-rebreather mask with anything less you'll not be delivering 100% O2 and run the risk of causing further injury (read: plastic bag on the face...). Plus, for a boat you would really want a good Pelican-like case to keep it all in so it will stay clean, high and dry.

I've never paid more than $8.00 for an O2 fill, so it's not expensive, especially if you are not having to fill it often.

-Valerie

[Zen Diver]

PM sent.

-Valerie

[CaptnJack]

I have 3 med O2 regs at home right now that go to 15+L/min. There's just an 0.077 orifice controlling the flow anyway. One of them I drilled out to a larger size and it gushes O2 (or He in my case) now.
They look sorta like this:
http://www.lifemedicalsupplier.com/oxyg ... -2167.html

You can get them off Ebay used with both CGA 540 fittings and CGA 870 fittings. All of mine cost <$25. Try to find a newish one though cause the diaphrams can get old and tear. At that point you might as well throw it away and get another.

The 870 valve is the vertical style used on small medical cylinders
#1 in this pic

#8 is the style used on larger cylinders


If you don't really understand how med regs work stick to the DAN kit. If you're handy and do some reading you can easily build one for fractions less.

As for as the non-rebreather mask, you really should only use them on concious patients. And you should still have one side's vent holes open just in case the flow is pinched off.

I have a DAN kit with a Jumbo D, a couple of non-rebreather masks and an extra E size cylinder. The tanks don't really require maintenance unless you use or practice with them. I think my E size expired on hydro last year. Until I use it it just sits in the storage locker on the boat. Even DAN says not to bother getting them VIPed.

[scottsax]

Wow. Just wow, that's a lot of information. Think I'll take the DAN classes, take Rescue Diver, do a bunch of shore dives, get the rest of my gear squared away, then worry about outfitting his boat for crab season next year. I'm handy, I've even done complex natural gas line plumbing, but I think for emergency gear, I'll just buy an O2 setup.

*sigh*

I'm fixing my truck this weekend so I can dive next weekend, dammit!

[Dmitchell]

*sigh*

I'm fixing my truck this weekend so I can dive next weekend, dammit!

I'm teaching diving this weekend so that I can dive next weekend! Only have 9 dives and a pool session to do this weekend to get everyone done!


Dave

[Zen Diver]

One of them I drilled out to a larger size and it gushes O2 (or He in my case) now.

Drilling into anything O2 related makes me nervous. Some folks may think they are "handy" but why take the chance with first aid?

You can get them off Ebay used with both CGA 540 fittings and CGA 870 fittings. All of mine cost <$25. Try to find a newish one though cause the diaphrams can get old and tear. At that point you might as well throw it away and get another.

Again, it can be taking a chance. What's "newish?"

As for as the non-rebreather mask, you really should only use them on concious patients.

Non-rebreathers can be used on unconscious patients as well, especially if their respirations or tidal volume isn't enough to trigger the demand valve. Obviously you would not leave them alone (or any injured diver on oxygen) tho. If you really want more bang for the buck, you could get the Manually Triggered Valve, which enables you to not only have a demand valve, but a rescusitation valve as well. Add on Bag-Valve-Mask and you are set for CPR scenarious (these are covered DAN's Advanced O2 course).

I have a DAN kit with a Jumbo D, a couple of non-rebreather masks and an extra E size cylinder. The tanks don't really require maintenance unless you use or practice with them. I think my E size expired on hydro last year. Until I use it it just sits in the storage locker on the boat. Even DAN says not to bother getting them VIPed.

Recommendation is to get them hydro'd as per scuba cylinders (every 5 years) and per the manufacturer's recommendation. My Jumbo D that I got with my DAN kit states every two years for servicing.

As a DAN Instructor, Assistant Instructor, Emergency Nurse (RN, BSN,CEN) someone who's been bent AND personally known several others who have taken hits as well, I think it's foolhardy to try to do EMERGENCY FIRST AID on the cheap. When the s**t hits the fan ain't no one escaping unscathed. With proper gear and equipment you can make a (positive) difference.

In my humble opinion, of course.

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on this point.

-Valerie

[CaptnJack]

This months Alert Diver actually recommends not putzing with a full O2 cylinder just to VIP or hydro it. I don't recall the page number.

It seems that a large number of board members here are quite cost concious. I proposed an O2 delivery option using all made for medical O2 use parts for a fraction of the DAN kits costs. About 60% less.

Personally I am VIPing my own tanks, O2 cleaning my own gear, mixing + filling my own EANx and trimix. And yes I have taken medical O2 regulators and adapted them to continuous blend with my compressor. If you are not comfortable with the innards of a regulator that's fine. But they are simple to work on, once you muster up the confidence to open them up and understand them. And for someone who's comtemplating not having any O2 aboard at all (due to the hgh cost of the DAN kits) vs. having a self assembled kit building their own is a viable option.

E.g. an orifice is merely a precision sized hole. The output pressure on most med regs is 0 to 8 psi. The flow through a 0.077" orifice when the pressure is maxed out to 8psi is 15-18L/min.

Need more flow? Drilling a larger orifice (the fitting are brass) leads to more flow. I have the formula to calculate the flow at home but its not hard to estimate mathematically. And if you want a precise flow after drilling take a 2L pop bottle, fill it with water, and invert it into 5 gal bucket. You can time how long it takes to fill with O2 (or any other gas you might be using the reg for - say He). Make yourself new dial labels and away you go.