So I need help with ear issues. Very disheartening.

[BigFameOne]

Had my first day of OW at Cove 3 yesterday. Had had some issues in the pool with my left ear but eventually got down to the 10ft floor, was a bit worried going into OW but thought "Hell take it slow, and be honest about what you feel in there" to be honest I was more worried about OW stuff than the ear thing(like vis, or just panic and no longer being in such a controlled environment). My instructor Gerry has been great and did me a real service yesterday when things started to complicate. First dive was smooth, ear was an issue (well both were a BIT of an issue) but finally I was comfy at 35 feet. We got out for our SIT and when we went back in confidence was high because the stuff I had really been concerned about were not an issue. Vis was great, wasn't cold, ocean didn't scare me at all, had a blast and I am told cove 3 is the least exciting of those sites on alki and we had a blast with the marine life there so we get in only this dive doesn't go as well. I forgot to shave so I had been having a bit of an issue with leaking mask but had been practicing that a lot so it wasn't an issue except that it seemed I was clearing once every few minutes. The real issue was my ears, left one just wouldn't cooperate and we got down to about 15 or 20 feet and my left ear was bothering me, in trying to equalize I would plug my nose and immediately flood my mask completely, then I'd clear, and continue to try and work on the ear a bit, and of course flood the mask again. I was using the valsalva since it is easy, and then trying to add a swallow but found it difficult to swallow on dry air. We ascended a bit, but with the ear being a bit painful and the mask flooding badly I decided to stop working on the ear and regroup. I cleared my mask so I could at least see where I was and where the other divers were and Gerry and I decided to go up and talk. Once up top we talked about the ear a bit and while bobbing in the waves I spit, and he saw some blood. Not much, just a tint to the spit but I am dumb enough I would have kept trying and luckily he was wise enough to call it for me. I went in feeling like I had really failed, and let he and the other folks down. Now I had gotten to 35 feet comfortably so I know that even MY ears can do this. I had been trying to clear early and often, although had never though to start above the water. Spent most of the night reading Doctor Edmond Kays info on ear equalizing techniques and ear fear, and watching his video. Was very informative but I think I am going to have to call my dives off today and go watch them dive so I can at least be helpful since I feel as though I have two ear aches and the left is certainly more tender. I also have stuffy nosed that I didn't have yesterday. I have decided that rather than take a risk today that could end my ability to dive in the future or prolong it way longer than I want to it is better to just say uncle and regroup. Anyone get past ear issues? anyone have suggestions? I am going to my doctor tonight for non related stuff but will talk with him, maybe seeing an ear, nose and throat doc would be a good idea. In that case is any ENT going to be good enough? or can you all recommend one with diving knowledge in the Seattle area I might see?

Thanks, sorry that was long,

[Nwbrewer]

I sent you a PM on SB too, don't be disheartened. I'm sure some others will chime in with stories of ear issues in OW. (Laivndl how many times did it take?)

You're making the right call staying out today. A big part of diving is knowing when, and having the courage to call the dive when it needs to be. In your case, it was before you packed your gear, good job.

As far as a good ENT for diving, Dr. Kay is local.


Jake

[BDub]

Don't get too discouraged, this isn't that uncommon.

You were able to do it once, so at least you know you're able to do it. Keep in mind that your ears aren't used to being exposed to that kind of pressure, so they're moving and exercising in ways they're not used to.

While you may be limited in how frequently you dive at first, or how many dives you can do in a day, as your ears become more acclimated to being exposed to pressure, it'll get easier.

Good call on sitting out today. I'm sure it was a tough one, but you'll be better off in the long run.

[Joshua Smith]

Sounds like you're getting some good info already. I'm guessing your instructor is Gerry from NWSD? He's a great teacher, and a really nice guy, too. You're in good hands. All I can tell you is that I'm one of those people who had a really hard time equalizing, at first. It gets easier with practice, or it did for me, at any rate. I still have issues with it, from time to time. But I rarely miss a dive because of it. I almost feel like I had to "teach" my ears what to do.

A couple of suggestions:

-Throughout the day, try "stretching" your eustacian tubes by yawning, moving your jaw around, whatever works for you.

-Do some dives where you just don't rush getting to depth- descend as slowly as you have to. Clear as you go. If you can't clear, ascend a little bit, and try again. (you need a very patient buddy for this one.)

-Pretty much everyone will tell you not to use scubafed.....uh......I mean sudafed. What can I say, it has worked for me. I only use it occasionally, when I can tell that my ears might give me some problems.


Talk to your doctor, like you said you were planning to.

There are some products that are supposed to help with ear clearing- like Doc's proplugs. I've never tried them, so I can't comment.

And don't ever force it- trust me, it's not worth it.

[BigFameOne]

thanks folks you guys rock!


It is really hard for me to call it today, I am so excited about diving, I just feel like sometimes you have to take a calculated step back in order to go forward. In the same vein I would much rather sit on the beach and watch them come in than go in and hurt myself. I will call Dr Kay's practice and see if I can get in to see him, I just want to make sure that I am only fighting an uphill battle (which doesn't scare me at all) not an one that I can't win. Again thanks, I am always very impressed with the local dive community seems like I am very lucky to live here for so many reasons, you folks certainly being one.

So I'll be at NWSD at noon, and then at cove 3 I presume shortly there after sitting on he wall, if you are in the area, I'll buy you a cup off coffee.

[airsix]

BFO, the only thing I can add to what has been said (which is good stuff) is that I also have a very difficult time swallowing with my regulator in my mouth. If you dive with me you'll see me pull my reg out of my mouth for a moment several times over the course of a dive. I do this in order to swallow and wet my mouth. It's hard to swallow when your jaw is lowered to hold a mouthpiece so you might try the remove/replace reg trick (if you are comfortable with doing it) next time you feel you need to swallow. Also, it sounds like you might want to look for a better fitting mask. A finicky mask can be a real distraction and stress-inducer when you are trying to manage other issues. Hang in there. You'll get it all worked out.

-Ben

[dwashbur]

While I understand the disappointment of not being able to do the rest of your dives, keep one thing in mind: YOU. HAVE. NOT. FAILED!!!!! Nor have you let ANYBODY down. We've all been there, and we all know the basic rule: ANY diver can call it ANY time for ANY reason. I practically recite that in my sleep. The fact is, you came back alive and with both eardrums intact, and you're taking the proper steps to deal with the problem. That, my friend, is a MAJOR success. If you had pushed it and ruptured an eardrum, that would have been a failure. You, on the other hand, are doing everything right. Your willingness to back off and correct the problem, even though it means taking a little longer to realize your dream, tells us you're the kind of person we're all going to be comfortable diving with. Take that with you and be encouraged. The certification will come, and when it does it'll be that much sweeter. But you've already learned the most important lesson in diving: don't push the safety things, because there's always tomorrow.

Let us know when you finish your course, because I'd be honored to dive with you.

[scottsax]

BFO-I can't really add anything to the discussion, except to say that I had trouble with nosebleeds when I first started diving, primarily because my mask leaked, I was perhaps a little too enthusiastic in grabbing my nose to clear my ears, and I lived a rock and roll lifestyle in the 90s. ](*,) Needless to say, it's made for some panicked looks from my buddies when we'd surface....

As a musician, my ears are sensitive, and I've called dives because of ear issues, and most likely will do so in the future. We've all been there....

[defied]

Dr. Kay is good people. He visited my Dive Medicine class back in '01, and explained sinuses and diving in depth. It was very educational. I usually pop my jaw from left to right, and that does the trick. It never used to until many many many practice sessions, as well as dive jobs. Before then I hit up the sudafed. Not excessively, mind you, but I would grab a tab to clear up any allergies I may have.

I'm not sure what peoples stance of sudafed is on this board, but in the commercial dive scene, it's a godsend when you need it because if you don't dive, you don't get paid.

[Metal man]

I can relate to the fears and problems you mentioned. Days before my pool session I got online and read up on clearing and problems associated with it. Had a lot of problems getting past 6 feet in the pool all weekend and realized that clearing my ears on purpose was something I had never done much of besides the occasional drive in the mountains. So the week before my OW course I cleared my ears several times a day every day, at work, home, even driving down the road. After that I had no problems dropping to 40 feet. I also read that you may want to (pre load) your ears just before you drop down, that is, clear them just before your head goes under, this will give you a little headstart for that first few feet.

[amandacastleman]

I bruised my ears the first post-OW dive:

http://www.roadandtravel.com/travel%20d ... nduras.htm

The divemaster told me to pop some sudafed and head back down with him, ditching my yo-yo buddy. Instead I went to the resort's doc, who reported stage 3 barotrauma (4 is a burst eardrum, if I remember correctly).

As a writer, I got a nifty metaphor outta the deal. But otherwise, the experience sucked ... from seeing the Moskita lobster fishermen a week into their chamber holiday to loitering in the pool while others dove (though I did find Port Royal beer helped the poutiness).

Wish I'd called the dive like you! Keep up the good calls.

[Pinkpadigal]

Ear issues are serious. You can do some serious damage if you "push it" and then you are beached. While most of my hearing loss is a heredity, diving hasn't helped. I had ear ringing for 3 weeks about 6 years ago from a pinhole in my drum caused by diving. It is very important that you listen to your ears and take care of them.

It is possible that you are starting to come down with a cold or sinus infection. The first place you feel it is in the water. Your ears and tubes felt it first, and it sounds like the rest of you is catching up. Make sure you stay hydraded and see how you feel in a few days.

There are a few over the counter items that work. I have used Sudafed, Clariton and Afrin. I found Afrin to be the best, in the short term, but over time, it no longer works.

As Gerry said, take your descents slow and easy. Scuba isn't a race and there is no hurry to get to the bottom. As your body gets used to diving, you will find clearing easier and easier. However, it does take time.

Good luck!

[BigFameOne]

thanks again to you all, it sucked to sit on the beach in the drizzle watching bubbles surface knowing that I should/could/would have been down there too. They went to 50 feet which I had to miss out on, and my buddies got two dives ahead of me (well 3 when you count the aborted dive yesterday). I went along to help with gear, and carry stuff and learn whatever I could. I also went to doctor today who suggested afrin on dive days, but not often and not excessive. My buddies are all out of town next week, so Gerry said he would take me out on Tues and we can make up the missed dives. So I am going to continue practicing with my ears and reading up on it and will hope to have a better dive day on Tues. I really do appreciate your help folks. I do not regret calling my dive yesterday or the dives today, I do feel like I missed out but on the other hand I would rather miss a week than a few of them.

[lurch]

I also read that you may want to (pre load) your ears just before you drop down, that is, clear them just before your head goes under, this will give you a little headstart for that first few feet.

I do this every time I drop.

Baby your ears. Practice clearing. Clear early and often (before your head submerges is not "too early"). Puget Sound will be there tomorrow.

I'm sure some others will chime in with stories of ear issues in OW. (Laivndl how many times did it take?)

Times to pass NAUI Scuba Diver? Three I think. After that I was the victim of three ear infections. Talk about disheartening... ](*,)

[Nwbrewer]

I'm sure some others will chime in with stories of ear issues in OW. (Laivndl how many times did it take?)

Times to pass NAUI Scuba Diver? Three I think. After that I was the victim of three ear infections. Talk about disheartening... ](*,)

I knew it took you a while.... BFO, note that he did pass... now he works at a dive shop.... :occasion5:

[oregondiver]

Oddly enough, I am having ear problems myself, but they cant' diagnose it. MRI is next...

WHen you aren't used to clearing your ears, it is hard to do "on command" so to speak/write. As others have said...start practicing when on land. Day in. Day out. I have TMJ, and my jaw can literally "unhinge" so I got that whole clearing of the ears down pat, except when my ear is being a shit, like right now.

I also blew a pinhole in my ear while diving in the Caymans for 3 weeks. Not knowing what the problem is, but the ringing was loud enough I thought I was in church 24 hours a day, with all the bells going on. When I made it back to Florida, I went to a diving ENT (referral through DAN, so make sure to get your DAN insurance!) who prescribed prescription strength Claritin. It took about 2 weeks to fully clear up, but my flights back home were horrible!!!

It seems to me that you need a new mask. I don't get the whole shaving/not shaving thing, maybe the boys can answer that. But my mask fits so perfectly that I don't need a back strap on it (except when I lose pressure). It is perfectly fitted that unless a edge is snagged on my hood, it NEVER gets water in it. So I think you should try a different mask. Having a good fitting mask will help you be able to pay attention to the ear issue better rather than trying to multitask in a new environment, underwater...

Good luck, SYUW (see you underwater)
shell

[lurch]

I'm sure some others will chime in with stories of ear issues in OW. (Laivndl how many times did it take?)

Times to pass NAUI Scuba Diver? Three I think. After that I was the victim of three ear infections. Talk about disheartening... ](*,)

I knew it took you a while.... BFO, note that he did pass... now he works at a dive shop.... :occasion5:

And BFO: Three years ago I was right where you are now. Discouraged by medical issues and wondering if I'd wasted the money I sunk into getting certified.

Now I consider that money completely worth it.

My problem was different and I won't go into it here (if you really want to know find me at NWSD on weekends). But I still felt like pond scum when I was forced to take a lengthy surface interval between my second and third, then third and fourth open water dives.

[BigFameOne]

much appreciated man. I think we have met, a couple buddies and I came in and paid for this class while you were working and then came back to get "geared up". You showed us some Nudibrach photos and stuff. I have been a bit discouraged this week (hell I even broke my finger yesterday, been a rough week) bu I am no less confident that I will get this done. I really appreciate the support folks, I didn't see this issue coming and I am glad to know I am not the only person to ever deal with it, nor am I the only to have obstacles of some kind to overcome. You guys are great.

Jake

[BASSMAN]

Just a quick note:
I have this one buddy, who I have only dove a few times with, but on every dive, He comes up with Blood in his mask.
I would ask all the questions and he said clearing his ears was no problem , no pain felt anywhere at any time.
After about the fourth dive with this guy {different days} I decided to ask D.A.N. about it and the response was...
Everyone has a certain amount of airspace that is filled with Spit, Snot and sometimes Blood as a diver ascends.
They said if there is no pain, it is not a problem to see a little blood in your mask at the end of a dive. I think it bothered me more than it bothered him.



Just my 2 cents



Keith

[BigFameOne]

thank you all, I had two more dives today at cove 3. One in at 26 minutes with a depth of 29 feet, and the second one was 31 minutes with max depth of 55 feet. No pain or discomfort at all, I just started inflating above water, and again with each foot or two I dropped. I came out after the second dive with a little blood in my spit but ZERO discomfort at all. I was pretty down this week about it, afraid that I would go down and have to call it again. Gerry was very helpful and patient and we had a great smooth dive. At times it even appeared that I had control of my buoyancy and trim (and of course at times I was in essence tumbling or hand-walking the bottom). I will dive again this Wednesday and SHOULD get my card. Thanks for all the input and support. I did get a pair of Doc's proplugs, and I do not know if they helped or if it was starting to equalize earlier or going slower or even working on my ears MORE often but whatever it was it worked perfectly and I now at least feel confident that I can get certified. Thanks again folks.

[babs13]

You are in good hands....Gerry is a good guy. After you get your card, let's go diving! PM me if you are up for diving.

[BigFameOne]

I certainly will, thank you very much. I have a lot of faith in Gerry he has been great to learn from. Looks like two dives tuesday at cove 3 and cove 2 and then maybe lake Washington and at that point it all begins.

[Nwbrewer]

So are you done? Time to go diving!

[Sounder]

Yup - they're done!! We met him yesterday on his final check-out dive!

[BigFameOne]

yep all done, and very happy. After the ear issues I had my doubts but doing cove 2 yesterday was fantastic, I still can't get over the Octo we saw. I owe a round of thanks to the three divers we met yesterday (LundySD, and Sounder and Dette} for being understanding and in fact help direct me down to where I'd be able to really see the Ocopus. I wish I could go dive today but I will have to wait till Tues to go to EUWP. THanks again to everyone who has been so helpful and patient with me. NwBrewer of course, Lynne for sure, Gerry, Dan W, and more. I am very proud to be a diver in the NW and be involved in a hobby that these people are also involved in.

Jake