No Mask?

[Joshua Smith]

You know what I don't get? The huge emphasis on "no mask" stuff I read about in some tech training. I went through TDI and IANTD, and I had to remove my mask, put the strap around my arm, retrieve my backup mask from my pocket, and put it on, at least once, sometimes more than once, in every class. I guess my "tech" certs would be Advanced Nitrox/ Deco procedures, Normoxic CCR trimix, and Full (hypoxic) trimix. During full trimix, I believe, we had to take off our masks, follow a line, find a stage bottle attached to the line, and retrieve/clip the stage to our harness, and work our way back to where we started from.

But it wasn't a major part of the class- the no mask stuff was just another hurdle. Kind of a "confidence builder." I get the impression, from numerous class reports I have read, that Naui Tech, DIR, and UTD remove student's masks almost routinely throughout any given class- practically on every dive. Maybe I'm wrong- I have no first-hand experience, other than making a half-hearted attempt to audit Naui intro to tech with Ken and Howard last year. But I sure read a lot of stuff about no mask work in tech classes. My question is: "Why so much?" With just a little bit of practice, I am perfectly comfortable with the thought of having someone kick my mask off, and having to dig my backup mask out of my pocket and put it on. (And god help the next diver who even gets NEAR me and my backup mask after that! ) I know I can do it. So why practice being a blind diver so much? Like most people on this board, I'm a walking encyclopedia of dive accidents, deaths, and mishaps. If it got written up on the internet, I bet I read about it. And I can't remember a single "lost mask, didn't have a backup" tech diving fatality or injury.

Now, I never did the whole DiveMaster thing- but several years ago, when I took PADI rescue diver with Bob Helton, Bob's AI was my buddy Jason, aka DiverDown on this site. Jason made me do a lot of the DM stuff in the pool during the class- dive down and exchange gear on the bottom, or sink our rigs, then dive down and put them on, and swim to the shallow end while buddy breathing- that kind of stuff. And I loved it. I relished the challenge of just trying something new underwater. And, yes- it's completely impractical- what kind of crazy-ass circumstances are going to have *anyone* needing to do any of that stuff? But, yes- it gives a student a sense that "Wow! If I can do THAT underwater, what else can I do?" I get that. But I'm still baffled by some of the scenarios I read about students doing. It's remotely concievable that someone might have a primary and a secondary light fail.....but both secondary lights, and their primary? Or, a team of 3 has all 9 of their lights fail, two of them lose their masks, and one of them runs out of gas, another has a post failure, and the third looses a fin? All I can think of is that these are 3 people I NEVER want to dive with- either they're very unlucky, or just don't take care of their gear.

(Puts on flame retardant suit)

In summary, I just wonder if some of the torture testing isn't a bit over done in training. It's a good idea to find out how potential tech divers react to stress, of course. But to me, there's a world of difference between being good at no mask drills in a training situation, and dealing with real problems on real tech dives. Just because you're good at one, doesn't mean you'll be good at the other.

[BDub]

Josh, the no mask stuff is meant to test the diver's comfort level with no mask, of course. However, it also really tests the no mask diver's teammate's ability to manage the remainder of the dive when one of their team has no mask, for one.

Obviously a diver losing their mask changes the entire dynamic (and yes, if you lose a mask, you have a backup, or your teammate has a backup, or your other teammate has a backup, which all "magically" disappear in the critical skills dives) and that's what the focus is on in the training.

To put it simply, the diver with no mask has the easy job. Their teammates are being tested

Edit- I'll add that the critical skills dives don't mimic reality, nor are they meant to. They are meant to push the diver's capacity so when a problem does occur, its a non-issue. Of course a team of 3 isn't going to experience 9 light failures, but when they do run into a problem, that problem is so "minor" compared to the failures they had to deal with in their training, its not something that they'll get hung up on. They'll fix it and move on.

[spatman]

i think some of it is also to add to the trainees' task load. burden them with many tasks/problems during training, so that if one or even two things fail, they have a sense and some experience of how they react under real pressure.

[Joshua Smith]

Cool- I mean, yeah, I get those points. I'm not really sure how to frame my question, I guess. I mean- there is no way to train someone to be prepared for the unforeseen mistake/disaster/equipment failure that might happen in the real world, right? So, training is an attempt to mimic stress, and test the student's ability to handle stress. Students are definitely stressed during training- I know I have had some underwater blood pressure spikes during classes- but, at the same time, these training stressors all happen in a more-or-less controlled environment, with an instructor and DM or assistant ready to make sure that nobody *actually* dies, right? I guess that there's no actual way to train for the real world- what about a buddy separation at 250'? Or getting blown off the wreck in current, and losing the downline? I know that these things are never supposed to happen, but I bet they happens a lot more often than people losing their masks and their backup masks at the same time, or manifold failures, or even rebreather failures.

Like I said, I guess I don't know how to frame the question properly. Since I started diving, I've always been the kind of "what if?" diver that constantly thinks about how I would react to various situations- I like protocols. If "A", then, "B". That sort of thing- pilots have made this into a science. They have checklists and procedures for almost every conceivable contingency. And I admire them for that. But for as many parallels and similarities as there are between aviation and diving, they are different. (Side note- if you've ever spent any time on Rebreather world, you must have noticed how many pilots like CCR diving. The second biggest subgroup of CCR divers appears to be former motorcycle racers looking for a safer hobby)

I still love the training I took- I like challenges. In January, up in Nanaimo with Ken and Dan, I had a weird CCR failure- it turned out to be a bad 02 cell, but, to make a long story short, after a fast drop onto the deck of the Cape Breton, my displays showed me a very wide range of pp02s. I stared at them for just a fraction of a second- just long enough to think: "%$#@! I have no idea what I'm breathing right now!" And before I could even think about it, I was executing the routine I did so many times in training- it was amazing to me- I felt like a spectator, watching my hands flush the loop with diluent, and grabbing the reg off my bailout bottle. (That reminds me- I need to buy Mel another bottle of Crown Royal.) So, training is good. But there are things you can train for, and then there are....other things. I like what I've heard Andrew Geogitsis say about making "thinking divers", but sometimes I wonder if they can be "made." Is a bunch of "no-mask" work really going to do that, or does it just make people good at diving without a mask?

[Pez7378]

It's all hype. I wasn't really bothered by taking off my mask. It's just hype. I didn't care when BDub took my mask when I was sharing air with Joe. I just like to scare the kids. When I read about people losing their mask while doing an air share and trying to call deco during a midwater ascent after shooting an SMB, I thought, wow. I could never do that. After the first time I had a drysuit failure while running line, and had to remove it at depth just before I lost my mask during an air share followed by a six gill sighting, I realized that I could handle some very basic problems underwater if the need ever arose. I became more confident. As far as the dramatic reports..........It's all hype.

That, and were just not at your level yet.

[Joshua Smith]

That, and were just not at your level yet.

I guess I'm feeling just a little self conscious about that, Chris. I'm new to tech diving, because I've only been doing it for a couple of years, now. And I learn new stuff almost every time I dive. I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "your level."

[LCF]

Josh, I know my reports have talked a lot about having my mask removed. And my mask gets removed a lot, because I don't cope with it very well. BECAUSE I get disoriented in midwater without a good visual reference, and because that disorientation frequently leads to significant buoyancy control issues, my tech-type instructors have thrown this problem at me again and again. I don't really think it happens that much to people with better basic skills.

[CaptnJack]

I've lost my mask a few times in training and had to manage no mask people (control their buoyancy for them, make their switches for them, time and shoot a bag without them, etc.). First time was a bitch and it can been really hard if the two masked buddies end up working at cross purposes. I agree with Josh though, no mask can be overdone, its not the "be all" skill that somehow makes you competent.

As far as training being "for real" or not... Well I have had a couple "come to Jesus" moments in real life and one in training - the latter was in my full cave (2) class. We were doing a lights out gas sharing drill from a place called Satan's Silthole. Which has a silty floor but that's not the big a deal in the dark anyway. The line runs something ugly in there though, crossing back and forth a few times and its high on the wall for a bit, quite close to the ceiling which is no fun in the dark.

We went in for 800 psi (al80 doubles, 1/3rds minus 200psi) turned around and maybe 100psi later I was OOG - we turned our own lights off per prior agreement. In other words we were net 700psi into the cave and maybe 900ft back at 55-60ft. Assuming we would use as much gas getting out as in we <should> have surfaced with 2100-1400 = 700psi. We reached our O2 with 250-300psi. I was doing a flow check at 40ft in case we had to access my gas (I obviously had about 2100psi still). Anyway, we were "in the red" and if had been doing a dive on 1/3rds or if I had gone OOG at maximum penetration instead of ~100psi back we were "dead". Ok understandable, not that big a deal we had a "safety net" right...

Nope. Our instructor actually lost track of us in the dark and we got far enough ahead that he couldn't "feel" us on the line, nor see our gauges. He had left the reel and returned into the cave to double-check we had made it out. At that level they aren't checking your gas in the dark for you, he knew that collectively we had a ton even though I was "OOG". So I guess my point is that safety nets, even in class but esp. in upper level classes, are not always what they appear and you need to calmly work together like they don't exist.

[CaptnJack]

I like what I've heard Andrew Geogitsis say about making "thinking divers", but sometimes I wonder if they can be "made." Is a bunch of "no-mask" work really going to do that, or does it just make people good at diving without a mask?

Well the maskless diver has it made, they are basically inert. Its their buddy(s) that have the tough job doing all their normal diving responsibilities and divying up and executing the maskless person's stuff. Watching someone else's midwater buoyancy and anticipating your own and theirs in time to tell them to up, down, or level-off, even from just 100ft is not very easy the first few times. Likewise timing stops while shooting bag and doing someone else's gas switch for them. The whole point is that (e.g.) the Rouse's had a ton of gas on their backs but they ended up on the surface and died because even after they had ascended and their narcosis had abated they were "done" thinking. I'm not sure no-mask drills really help you think all <that> much, but they do at least help a little to expand your buddies capacity to juggle and prioritize the long list of tasks needed to "get home". In a controlled setting obviously.

I will tell you doing a toxing diver rescue is way more difficult than no-mask stuff though. I need to practice that ALOT more.

[Pez7378]

That, and were just not at your level yet.

I guess I'm feeling just a little self conscious about that, Chris. I'm new to tech diving, because I've only been doing it for a couple of years, now. And I learn new stuff almost every time I dive. I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "your level."

[Sounder]

The no-mask thing adds complexity and stress. If someone doesn't deal well without their mask, it stresses them - pushes them. If someone needs more task-loading practice, take their team member's mask... suddenly, the masked team member gets busy.

For me, this is my first experience running line and interacting with line. I'm learning to run it, retrieve it, tie it, manage it, etc. Part of that is learning how to exit on the line blind, both in the dark w/mask and without mask. When blind by whatever mechanism, I'm learning how to communicate while exiting, as a team, in single-file, on the line. I'm impaired so seeing an OOA signal isn't as easy (though with bright lights flashing quickly, I'd donate and if it wasn't an OOA, we'd sort that out once I knew that) so I have to be ready for a regulator to be taken from my mouth. I have slung bottles I have to keep out of the line, I have to maintain my buoyancy, and all the while, I still have some responsibilities to my team.

This is all new for me. The no-mask stuff wasn't really a "can you manage without a mask for a prolonged period?" Instead, it was an opportunity to practice new and different skills, as well as the same skills, with an added level of complexity. Being no-mask isn't a problem for me, though it is for some people. The skills like line (which other people have nailed) negotiation and exiting is completely new to me so it is important that I practice and have the chance to polish these skills. There are plenty of other skills I need a lot of work on to get up to my personal standards and my team's expectations, but the no-mask line stuff yesterday was something I thoroughly enjoyed which is why I highlighted it.

Tech 1 is proving to be the most challenging scuba course I've ever taken, which I suppose could be expected. Much of the information is brand new, the skills are somewhat new but require a MUCH higher level of proficiency and polish, and while my responsibilities to my team haven't changed, they've become a whole lot more critical - a T1 dive is different from a recreational dive. I'm loving this and am excited to do more no-mask stuff (it's weird, but I really enjoyed it). No-mask ascents and bottle switches are coming. If I'm lucky, I'll be the no-mask (inert) diver. If I'm unlucky, I'll be the responsible buddy to a maskless teammate. Something tells me that before this is finished, I'll have plenty of opportunities to do both.

[BDub]

Cool- I mean, yeah, I get those points. I'm not really sure how to frame my question, I guess. I mean- there is no way to train someone to be prepared for the unforeseen mistake/disaster/equipment failure that might happen in the real world, right? So, training is an attempt to mimic stress, and test the student's ability to handle stress. Students are definitely stressed during training- I know I have had some underwater blood pressure spikes during classes- but, at the same time, these training stressors all happen in a more-or-less controlled environment, with an instructor and DM or assistant ready to make sure that nobody *actually* dies, right? I guess that there's no actual way to train for the real world- what about a buddy separation at 250'? Or getting blown off the wreck in current, and losing the downline? I know that these things are never supposed to happen, but I bet they happens a lot more often than people losing their masks and their backup masks at the same time, or manifold failures, or even rebreather failures.

Like I said, I guess I don't know how to frame the question properly. Since I started diving, I've always been the kind of "what if?" diver that constantly thinks about how I would react to various situations- I like protocols. If "A", then, "B". That sort of thing- pilots have made this into a science. They have checklists and procedures for almost every conceivable contingency. And I admire them for that. But for as many parallels and similarities as there are between aviation and diving, they are different. (Side note- if you've ever spent any time on Rebreather world, you must have noticed how many pilots like CCR diving. The second biggest subgroup of CCR divers appears to be former motorcycle racers looking for a safer hobby)

I still love the training I took- I like challenges. In January, up in Nanaimo with Ken and Dan, I had a weird CCR failure- it turned out to be a bad 02 cell, but, to make a long story short, after a fast drop onto the deck of the Cape Breton, my displays showed me a very wide range of pp02s. I stared at them for just a fraction of a second- just long enough to think: "%$#@! I have no idea what I'm breathing right now!" And before I could even think about it, I was executing the routine I did so many times in training- it was amazing to me- I felt like a spectator, watching my hands flush the loop with diluent, and grabbing the reg off my bailout bottle. (That reminds me- I need to buy Mel another bottle of Crown Royal.) So, training is good. But there are things you can train for, and then there are....other things. I like what I've heard Andrew Geogitsis say about making "thinking divers", but sometimes I wonder if they can be "made." Is a bunch of "no-mask" work really going to do that, or does it just make people good at diving without a mask?

It's amazing you survived those dives, Josh.

I think I know what you're saying, and I completely agree. Experience is just as important as education. While we can go through many different scenarios in the critical skills dives, there is only so much you can simulate. That's where getting the experience comes in.

Too many people get caught up in trying improve their deficiencies by becoming Cove 2 Commandos....constantly doing the same dive, at a very benign site, over and over.

Going out, doing the dives, at different sites, pushing your limits (within your skill and certification level) and putting those skills to use in a "real" dive is what will make a well rounded diver.

[CaptnJack]

The no-mask thing adds complexity and stress. If someone doesn't deal well without their mask, it stresses them - pushes them.

If no mask is stressful, those divers really ought to rethink diving where you <must> problem solve UW. Being maskless is the easy job.

For me, this is my first experience running line and interacting with line. I'm learning to run it, retrieve it, tie it, manage it, etc. Part of that is learning how to exit on the line blind, both in the dark w/mask and without mask. When blind by whatever mechanism, I'm learning how to communicate while exiting, as a team, in single-file, on the line. I'm impaired so seeing an OOA signal isn't as easy (though with bright lights flashing quickly, I'd donate and if it wasn't an OOA, we'd sort that out once I knew that) so I have to be ready for a regulator to be taken from my mouth. I have slung bottles I have to keep out of the line, I have to maintain my buoyancy, and all the while, I still have some responsibilities to my team.

Don't forget you don't have the gas to do this "for real", unless you're diving 1/3rds (or less) after removing rock bottom. When problems happen for real you need to ascend and manage the issues in midwater (at deep stops or above) where you're not burning through so much gas. I can't speak for your class, but most try to have you work on issues on the bottom first, once you're proficient there with all the visual and tactile references you work on similar issues in mid-water.

[boydski]

Hi Josh,

I have to agree with you that the no-mask thing is a bit over-done in training. However, it can turn out to be a good thing. I remember one of my dumbest moments occured on my very first deco dive (Diamond Knot), I had completely lost my buddy, overstayed my welcome on the wreck looking for him and then headed up the line to do my VERY FIRST ever gas switch (70'). I had the hose to the deco bottle routed really bad, so the first time I turned my head to look for my missing buddy, the hose slid my mask sideways off the side of my head.

So I wound up alone at 70' snorting water up my nose because I was lauging so hard at the absurd situation that I had put myself in. I was able to recover my mask, complete my deco and eventually found my buddy sunbathing on the boat....

Now when I'm asked to remove my mask for training, I just hand it over as I know it will eventually come off when I least expect it.

[Nwbrewer]

I'm impaired so seeing an OOA signal isn't as easy (though with bright lights flashing quickly, I'd donate and if it wasn't an OOA, we'd sort that out once I knew that) so I have to be ready for a regulator to be taken from my mouth.

You don't need to worry about light signals, just bunch your buddy in the legs until they donate, right laivindil?

[dsteding]

Josh, respectfully, seriously, I think you're missing one of the fine points of no-mask work (and, Sounder, I think you may see this when your training is done). It may be a result of not being exposed to this type of training. That being said, I agree no-mask work can be overdone.

Brian has done a good job on hitting the high points. This isn't really about a no-mask "skill" or even doing "skills" maskless. It is about building a team, and the no-mask thing is one part of an instructor's toolbox to get that team cohesion together. I think students--and Sounder's post is a good example of someone early in the process--go into things thinking "I have to be perfect mid-water no-mask." The reality is, if the team is together and you don't freak out maskless, things are--as others have pointed out, easy for you.

So, why the emphasis? I think that one of the unique things about UTD training is the emphasis on breaking the incident chain before you get to far down the road to an accident. That is where the thinking diver component comes in, right? You can train all you want, but the reality is, the accident chain is not going to look like a practice dive in Cove 2. The maskless piece does a couple things, first, it builds bandwidth and team awareness, and, second, it makes you stop and think instead of going on autopilot. Most people that go into this type of training have their mid-water skills nailed, and have been a bit of a Cove 2 commando. Most haven't managed a maskless diver. Most haven't done a gas switch for someone who is maskless. So, this is a good tool for an instructor to introduce something that hasn't been drilled heavily and see how the team responds.

Our last dive in Tech 1 (now UTD Tech 2, I guess) was one maskless diver, two working posts, and an ascent from ~105. Gas switches, bottles blowing up, general mayhem. When you read that online you probably think "wow, that isn't reality--these UTD types are kinda overboard in their training." But, when you go through it, you find (and Andrew looks for this) that you can maintain a zen-like calm with all this mayhem about you--and you are keeping track of depth, time, environment and team. That's the point--you now have the situational awareness thing cold, so you can think, adapt and solve problems.

I've found myself going to that zen-like state a few times in my short tech diving career, and I'm glad I can get there in a conscious fashion. I also am glad I was pushed in my training beyond what I'd deal with in reality, and the maskless thing is a small part of that.

That being said, instructors willy-nilly pulling masks off people probably isn't the best use of the tool--it needs to be focused and considered, which is the real art of this type of instruction.

But, what do I know, I'm a goose-stepping lemming.

[CaptnJack]

Now when I'm asked to remove my mask for training, I just hand it over as I know it will eventually come off when I least expect it.

I did that once. And just went inert since having someone maskless basically makes them useless and I figured I was now expected to be useless. Except this was cave and I got my ass reamed for it - "you have a backup mask, why didn't you use it!!!" "Ummmm cause I figured I'd just lose that too??" The last type of response you want to condition in training is to not reach for tools at your disposal. Lesson learned, I always go for my backup mask. Wise instructors even let you keep it sporadically, that intermittent reinforcement thing is powerful.

[dsteding]

Lesson learned, I always go for my backup mask. Wise instructors even let you keep it sporadically, that intermittent reinforcement thing is powerful.

And, that is the point, isn't it? I feel like all the internet writings and class reports make people try and game the system to pass the class. Which sorta defeats the purpose.

I remember the first time I went maskless in T1, I got my backup out, put it on, cleared it (ahhh, warmth, comfort), looked around, took stock of the team, and said "cool, I'm good now." Then, off it came again. Of course, I then tried to remain the chief, but that is a separate discussion.

[CaptnJack]

I remember the first time I went maskless in T1, I got my backup out, put it on, cleared it (ahhh, warmth, comfort), looked around, took stock of the team, and said "cool, I'm good now." Then, off it came again. Of course, I then tried to remain the chief, but that is a separate discussion.

You still had a team? Lucky you.

I put my backup on once or twice in earlier classes but nobody ever let me keep it and eventually my conditioned response was - "ahhhh cool, I'm done for the day". Not the kind of problem solving behavior your supposed to be training, just an unintended consequence. As a dog trainer I can tell you the responses/mental processes you think you're training and those actually being trained don't always line up as neatly as you'd imagine.

[airsix]

Josh, regarding your question as to whether a thinking diver can be 'made' or not:

One of my favorite quotes is something Governor Arnold NoLastNamenecessary said when he was still a competitive body builder. To paraphrase: If you put a 10hp load on a 5ph motor it will burn up, but if you put a 10hp load on a 5hp man he will become a 10hp man.

To that end, yes, I believe you can 'make' a thinking diver because I believe that through progressively difficult exercises you can develop your abilities far beyond what you think you capable of. That goes for mental dexterity, stress management, physical strength, physical endurance, pain management, etc. You can expand your capabilities in all of those areas through training.

There's perhaps nothing magic about "mask off". Experiencing it in the wild is plausible, so experiencing it in training has direct benefit, but just as importantly I think of it as another plate you can throw on the barbell. And throwing more weight on the bar is the only way to get stronger.

[Sounder]

Yes, I should have touched on the team-building characteristic of it. I touched on this in my report of yesterday's events.

Having no mask and being off the line forced me to depend on my team and to trust my team. Not that I didn't before, but this forced it. It also tasked the team as I was no longer as much help as I was a minute ago... so in the same incident, we're learning different things (which is why I'm sure I'll be with-mask here soon when others are without).

I agree with Richard too - if you're not comfortable without a mask on, you should get that straightened out prior to technical training. I was comfortable, but learning new skills while handicapped added an interesting twist to the learning process.

FWIW, the no-mask thing hasn't been over-done in our class - it's happened exactly twice (so far). There has been plenty of other issues to contend with and that bubble gun and those "blue gloves of death" definitely have a way of creating chaos out of an otherwise relaxing and enjoyable time!

[CaptnJack]

To that end, yes, I believe you can 'make' a thinking diver because I believe that through progressively difficult exercises you can develop your abilities far beyond what you think you capable of. That goes for mental dexterity, stress management, physical strength, physical endurance, pain management, etc. You can expand your capabilities in all of those areas through training.

Maybe you're right, but I haven't learned very much in Cove 2 except how to stay calmer under fire. I am not all that mentally stressed although I get fairly animated and it can look that way. My task is to go slower so I don't stress out my buddies.

But actually pulling an "answer" from a reasonable set of possible choices comes from alot of diving - elsewhere.

I've found myself going to that zen-like state a few times in my short tech diving career, and I'm glad I can get there in a conscious fashion. I also am glad I was pushed in my training beyond what I'd deal with in reality, and the maskless thing is a small part of that.

Like getting blown off Waterman's into a downwelling, not exactly "come to Jesus" since we at least had scooters, but getting there.

Too many people get caught up in trying improve their deficiencies by becoming Cove 2 Commandos....constantly doing the same dive, at a very benign site, over and over.

Going out, doing the dives, at different sites, pushing your limits (within your skill and certification level) and putting those skills to use in a "real" dive is what will make a well rounded diver.

Yup, basically if all of your skills are honed to a keen edge at a benign site you have few skills for the tough times. Some, but a surprising number are not portable.

[Sockmonkey]

Josh, regarding your question as to whether a thinking diver can be 'made' or not:

That begs the chicken/egg question... are people who pursue tech type training already of the right mindset to evolve into thinking divers? How often to people wash-out of tech training like a navy seal going through bud/s? My guess is that the majority of folks who enter into a tech type class are already malleable.

I've always assumed the asinine amount no-mask stuff was about team building not about the blind-snuggling-up-with-your-dive-buddy skill. And having occur it early in tech training builds a foundation to start piling other complex building blocks on top of.

I'm using the word tech interchangeably with the word team... but it is tough to be secular.

-Eric

(And I bring a spare mask with me around here... but that might be cause split fins can easily knock your mask off)

[CaptnJack]

That begs the chicken/egg question... are people who pursue tech type training already of the right mindset to evolve into thinking divers? How often to people wash-out of tech training like a navy seal going through bud/s? My guess is that the majority of folks who enter into a tech type class are already malleable.

Its pretty easy to be dumb UW with or without a mask.

[Pez7378]

(And I bring a spare mask with me around here... but that might be cause split fins can easily knock your mask off)

Great, first guns, and now split fins...............